"DGVREIMAN" <dggrant@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:W82Na.35137$0v4.2558756@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
>
>
> IRAQI WMD UNFOLDING
>
> So, were the Iraqis hiding nuclear weapon parts or not? Answer:
> Yes.

Was that the reason given for entering into this illegal invasion?
NO!
Are there enough parts to make them the imminent threat publicized?
No!
Did we just "stumble" on something VERY minor, that is being exaggerated for
PR propagnanda andlies?
Yes.


>
> Did we find "some of them?" Answer: Yes.

Did we find what would be the equivalent of a few minor parts that COULD
possibly, maybe, sometime in the FAR future?
Yes.
Do they mean one hell of a lot?
NO!


>
>
> Are there more parts to find or to determine the disposition of
> these weapons? Yes.


Can you see into the future?
NO!



>
> I suspect some people will still be howling about not finding WMD
> unless we find a nuclear device ticking loudly. The point is that
> Saddam was hiding nuclear weapon parts, and Saddam lied when he
> said he was not. Period. End of story.

and the point is George Bush and his talking monkeys lied about why we
invaded Iraq!
End of story!


>
> In respect to chemical weapons we also know that Saddam dumped
> tons of those weapons in the Euphrates river AFTER the war
> started.

cite?
Why haven't they been found - or is the Euprates running a caustic material
that destroys everything dumped into it?


>No war, no dumping of chemical weapons.

Unsupported


No war, no
> finding hidden nuclear weapon parts.

Minor travesty, and NOTHING like the pre-war Bush propaganda.


No war, no finding hidden
> missiles scattered all over Iraq.

Cites?
Missles?
WE KNEW they had missles!
Ther was NEVER any demand about getting rid of ALL missles!
All we found was that he had a FEW missles that had a longer flight then the
U.N. allowed!


>No war, no finding 500,000 mass
> graves.

The mass graves were NEVER agiven aas a reason for the invasion.
The mass graves were from actions taken AFTER the first war - while WE
looked on!



>No war, no finding Mobile Biological Weapon's Labs.

Another minor situation, exaggterated as a PR lie


No
> war, no finding and stopping Saddam's direct terrorist link.

No terrorist link found!
There was as much training of terrorists IN the U.S. as there was in Iraq!

>No
> war, no finding 51 hidden MIG Aircraft, some of which were
> converted to spray chemical or biological weapons. No war, no
> finding drone aircraft capable of delivering chemical and
> biological weapons. Duh

Cites?
ANY plane is "capable" of delivering anything!


>
> However, it appears that in one respect PM Blair and President
> Bush did not reveal something about Saddam; In truth Saddam
> possessed many more proscribed WMD than we were told.

You have not shown ONE piece of evidence of a WMD!

You have shreds, lies, PR, speculation and ignorance.

We were told there were WEAPONS!
Weapons of IMMENENT danger.
WHERE ARE THEY???????????????




>
> Also, no war, and we would have never been able to prove that
> other radical Muslim terrorist groups were involved with Saddam,
> such as Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Answr-Islam, Martyrs Brigade and
> the PLO. Even today Hamas admitted it was involved in the attacks
> on our coalition soldiers in Iraq, and proclaimed they intended
> to increase such attacks.
>
> So finally, what I have been telling everyone for months, that is
> all of the Muslim radical terrorist groups are interconnected,
> has been irrefutably proved true. We cannot fight Al Qaeda
> without also fighting the rest of the radical Muslim goon groups.
> Further, it is also very clear that Israel has been fighting
> America's enemies all along. We owe Israel a debt of gratitude
> for the pain and suffering the Israeli people have endured
> because the radical Muslim goons hate America.

As you have apparently been telling everyone for months - you spew
conservative garbage, lies, and dittohead PR, and pretend it is reality -
and what George Bush THREATENED we would find!

"Pope Dilbert" <Vatican@NYC.com> wrote in message
news:h26Na.6304$Ey6.2427@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net ...
>
> "DGVREIMAN" <dggrant@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
>
news:W82Na.35137$0v4.2558756@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> >
> >
> >
> > IRAQI WMD UNFOLDING
> >
> > So, were the Iraqis hiding nuclear weapon parts or not?
Answer:
> > Yes.
>
> Was that the reason given for entering into this illegal
invasion?
> NO!

Doug Says: There were several reasons given for liberating Iraq
and deposing Saddam. The military action was certainly legal,
and was approved by our Congress almost unanimously. Hiding WMD
certainly was one of the main reasons we wanted to depose Saddam.
If you did not know that, you should not be posting about this
issue.


> Are there enough parts to make them the imminent threat
publicized?
> No!

Doug Says: Of course they are, they just need to be found. If
you find an integral element of a bomb hiding, and considering we
already know that Saddam disbursed elements of his WMD amongst
several hiding places, then finding the first key element of a
WMD certainly justifies the claim that Saddam was hiding WMD.
Did Saddam declare these elements of a nuclear weapon? No.
Would they have ever been located without an invasion. No.
Hiding key components of a nuclear weapon certainly provides a
threat to the free world, and especially a threat to those
nations that Saddam openly and publicly declared war upon in
December 2000.

> Did we just "stumble" on something VERY minor, that is being
exaggerated for
> PR propagnanda andlies?
> Yes.
>
Doug Says: We found a key component of a nuclear weapon that
was being hidden by Saddam. We also found Mobile Biological
Weapon Labs, and determined that some of Saddam's Generals dumped
Chemical Weapons in the Euphrates river. You call that minor?
What do you want, a mushroom cloud over NY? President Bush and
PM Blair said Saddam was hiding WMD and proscribed weapons, that
fact has been proved irrefutably.

> >
> > Did we find "some of them?" Answer: Yes.
>
> Did we find what would be the equivalent of a few minor parts
that COULD
> possibly, maybe, sometime in the FAR future?
> Yes.
> Do they mean one hell of a lot?
> NO!
>
Doug Says: Duh, was Saddam hiding key nuclear weapon parts or
not? Answer: Yes! Your claim that hiding such parts means
little is what is disingenuous. Saddam was hiding key components
of a nuclear weapon in several different sites, that fact is
clear. How long would it take for Saddam to tell his goons to
"dig up all components and assemble them? A day, two days
perhaps? Obviously, Saddam was not about to allow the UN
Inspectors find a nuclear weapon intact, or even allow them to
find his scattered key components of his nuclear weapon. The
only way these nuclear weapon components could be found was with
an invasion and capture of key Iraqi personnel. President Bush
and PM Blair were absolutely right. We would have been clearly
facing a full fission nuclear weapon from Saddam in the near
future if we had not invaded and deposed Saddam. Those are the
clear and unmistakable facts surrounding this issue.
>
> >
> >
> > Are there more parts to find or to determine the disposition
of
> > these weapons? Yes.
>
>
> Can you see into the future?
> NO!
>
> Doug Says: Consider the logic. Would Saddam go to all this
trouble to just hide a "single part" of a nuclear device? Naw,
even Saddam is not that stupid. The implication of this
discovery is clear. Saddam has dismantled his nuclear device,
and he has hidden the key parts in several different locations.
Saddam has done much the same with his other WMD, and the clear
fact is Saddam's WMD could be reassembled very quickly, but would
never be found by the UN Inspectors. PM Blair and President Bush
knew this, and without the resolve of President Bush and PM Blair
to use military force to depose Saddam and capture key Iraqi
personnel, we would have been facing not only Chemical and
Biological weapons from Saddam in the future, but nuclear weapons
as well.
> >
> > I suspect some people will still be howling about not finding
WMD
> > unless we find a nuclear device ticking loudly. The point is
that
> > Saddam was hiding nuclear weapon parts, and Saddam lied when
he
> > said he was not. Period. End of story.
>
> and the point is George Bush and his talking monkeys lied about
why we
> invaded Iraq!
> End of story!

Doug Says: Now you know that is not true. I just posted the
irrefutable proof that Saddam was lying about his WMD program.
That fact proves that President Bush and PM Blair were telling
the truth. If you disagree, then be specific about what you are
alleging and I will respond in kind. Your self-acclaimed
"proclamation" that someone lied without providing any proof or
even specificity does not amount to a hill of beans.
>
>
> >
> > In respect to chemical weapons we also know that Saddam
dumped
> > tons of those weapons in the Euphrates river AFTER the war
> > started.
>
> cite?
> Why haven't they been found - or is the Euprates running a
caustic material
> that destroys everything dumped into it?

Doug Says: The levels of Chemical weapons in the Euphrates were
found to be at "off the chart" levels at a site where the US
Marines were trying to pump drinking water. Check Fox, CNBC, AP
and UPI. All ran that story. Mustard, Blister and Nerve agents
were detected in the Euphrates. How did they get there? Are you
claiming the Euphrates "produces Mustard Gas" by simply flowing
through its reeds? Please check on these issue before you
challenge them.
>
>
> >No war, no dumping of chemical weapons.
>
> Unsupported
>
Doug Says: Nonsense! See above. The Iraqis clearly dumped some
of their chemical weapons in the Euphrates river *after* the war
started, and further, tried to poison the water in which the US
Marines were using for drinking water. Would have the Iraqi's
dumped those chemical weapons in the river without a war? OF
course not, why should they?
>
> No war, no
> > finding hidden nuclear weapon parts.
>
> Minor travesty, and NOTHING like the pre-war Bush propaganda.

Doug Says: President Bush said that Saddam was hiding WMD, duh,
we found some of the WMD Saddam was hiding, duh. Of course that
find proves irrefutably that what President Bush and PM Blair
said was the truth. Nothing could be more simpler to understand,
that is if you are not simple-minded, or biased against President
Bush.
>
>
> No war, no finding hidden
> > missiles scattered all over Iraq.
>
> Cites?
> Missles?
> WE KNEW they had missles!
> Ther was NEVER any demand about getting rid of ALL missles!
> All we found was that he had a FEW missles that had a longer
flight then the
> U.N. allowed!

Doug Says: Proscribed missiles were found and Saddam said he
would destroy them. However, what Saddam did not reveal is that
he had hundreds more missiles that he did not declare that were
scattered all over Iraq, some were even found on farms. Saddam
was clearly *hiding* proscribed missiles, launchers, missile
engines, 122MM rockets with chemical warheads, all were found
AFTER the invasion. Some 122MM rockets were found before the
war at the direction of the US Intelligence agencies, but others
were found after the war started, and would have never been found
without a war. Was Saddam hiding proscribed weapons from the UN
Inspectors like President Bush said? Answer: Of course.
>
>
> >No war, no finding 500,000 mass
> > graves.
>
> The mass graves were NEVER agiven aas a reason for the
invasion.
> The mass graves were from actions taken AFTER the first war -
while WE
> looked on!

Doug Says: Saddam's tyranny was quoted as one of the most
salient reasons to depose Saddam. When President Clinton signed
the Iraqi Liberation Act in 1998 into law, Saddam's tyranny and
oppression of his people was one of the main reasons given to
depose Saddam. Further, after the Gulf War the United Nations
specifically resolved there would be no regime change in Iraq.
The USA and Britain, with no help from the UN, established and
patrolled the No-Fly zones in an attempt to save the Shiites and
Kurds from further slaughter, and without America and Britain's
intervention in this matter Saddam would have murdered millions
more than he did.
>
>
>
> >No war, no finding Mobile Biological Weapon's Labs.
>
> Another minor situation, exaggterated as a PR lie

Doug Says: Secretary Powell provided the UN with diagrams of the
Mobile Biological Weapon Labs, and stated the existence of those
Labs was a primary reason to invade Iraq, and further stated the
UN inspectors would never be able to find them. Secretary Powell
was right. The Mobile Biological Weapon Labs existed, and much
the same as Saddam's nuclear system, Saddam disbursed these Labs
and the components to make Biological weapons over a large
territory, with the obvious purpose to be able to reassemble
these weapons on short notice. Without a war, we never would
have found these Mobile Biological Weapon Labs. Are these Labs
designed specifically to produce weapon grade biological and
chemical weapons? Answer: Yes. Is this find a major find? Of
course, as it proves Secretary Powell's intelligence information
to be absolutely perfect, and the reason to invade Iraq a sound
and prudent decision.
>
>
> No
> > war, no finding and stopping Saddam's direct terrorist link.
>
> No terrorist link found!
> There was as much training of terrorists IN the U.S. as there
was in Iraq!

Doug Says: Now you are raving. Specificity please. Saddam was
linked to terrorists, just like President Bush and PM Blair said
he was. Saddam may also have been furnishing WMD to terrorist
organizations - that issue is still under investigation.
>
> >No
> > war, no finding 51 hidden MIG Aircraft, some of which were
> > converted to spray chemical or biological weapons. No war, no
> > finding drone aircraft capable of delivering chemical and
> > biological weapons. Duh
>
> Cites?
> ANY plane is "capable" of delivering anything!
>
> Doug Says: Duh, if you did not read the news article about the
Australian's finding the mostly undeclared, hidden 51 MIG
Aircraft, in which some had been converted to spray biological
or chemical weapons then you know very little about this issue.
Aircraft are built to drop bombs, fire rockets, and fire
automatic cannon, NOT to spray chemicals. Aircraft must be
converted for the purpose of spraying chemicals, and that
conversion was hidden and denied by Saddam. We would have never
found these proscribed Aircraft without an invasion. Further,
some of these MIG's were the ones that Saddam delivered to Iran
during the first Gulf war. According to all accounts Iran did
not give Saddam back his MIG's, but that account has been proved
irrefutably false. Obviously, Saddam and Iran have been working
together in respect to Saddam hiding his weapons for years.
> >
> > However, it appears that in one respect PM Blair and
President
> > Bush did not reveal something about Saddam; In truth Saddam
> > possessed many more proscribed WMD than we were told.
>
> You have not shown ONE piece of evidence of a WMD!

Doug Says: You have not been paying attention. Mobile
Biological Weapon Labs, key components of nuclear weapons,
proscribed missiles, proscribed rockets designed to carry
chemical weapons, proscribed drone and MIG aircraft designed to
also carry chemical and biological weapons, chemical weapons
dumped in the Euphrates river ALL have been found ....and this
evidence is just so far. We have only inspected about 30% of all
suspected WMD sites.
>
> You have shreds, lies, PR, speculation and ignorance.
>
> We were told there were WEAPONS!
> Weapons of IMMENENT danger.
> WHERE ARE THEY???????????????

Doug Says: You need to learn to read. If the WMD weapon
components were scattered, that does not mean they did not
exist. They existed in pieces, readily to be reassembled in
short notice. That was clearly Saddam's plan to hide his WMD
from the UN Inspectors, and that plan would have worked if we had
not invaded Iraq.

Doug Grant (Tm)
>
>
>
>
> >
> > Also, no war, and we would have never been able to prove that
> > other radical Muslim terrorist groups were involved with
Saddam,
> > such as Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Answr-Islam, Martyrs Brigade
and
> > the PLO. Even today Hamas admitted it was involved in the
attacks
> > on our coalition soldiers in Iraq, and proclaimed they
intended
> > to increase such attacks.
> >
> > So finally, what I have been telling everyone for months,
that is
> > all of the Muslim radical terrorist groups are
interconnected,
> > has been irrefutably proved true. We cannot fight Al Qaeda
> > without also fighting the rest of the radical Muslim goon
groups.
> > Further, it is also very clear that Israel has been fighting
> > America's enemies all along. We owe Israel a debt of
gratitude
> > for the pain and suffering the Israeli people have endured
> > because the radical Muslim goons hate America.
>
> As you have apparently been telling everyone for months - you
spew
> conservative garbage, lies, and dittohead PR, and pretend it is
reality -
> and what George Bush THREATENED we would find!
>
>