Maybe some new leadership could turn things around. I'd like to see AGD
become a prominent force in paintball again.

--
Volt - TI2 #007
What ought one to say then as each hardship comes? I was practicing for
this, I was training for this.
- Epictetus

"Rick Scott" <rick@shadowspar.dyndns.org> wrote in message
news:628e.41c7615a.d52c3@shadowspar...
> Tom Kaye's retiring from paintball. Dave Zupan, his VP, is taking
> over AGD.
>
> Here's the thread link:
> http://www.automags.org/forums/showthread.php?t=160739
>
> I don't know about you guys, but it really bums me out to see so
> many of the titans of the `old-school' paintball scene getting out
> of the industry.
>
>
>
>
> Rick
> --
> key CF8F8A75 / print C5C1 F87D 5056 D2C0 D5CE D58F 970F 04D1 CF8F 8A75
> Millions long for immortality who do not know
> what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon.
> :Susan Ertz

>Maybe some new leadership could turn things around. I'd like to see AGD
>become a prominent force in paintball again.

Wouldn't we all. Unfortunately when you look at the technology surrounding
AGD, it is going to be EXTREMELY difficult for them to be able to cut off a
piece of the market that currently exists.
Basically, any time a company wants to get a corner of the market they can go
one of two ways: Improve on current technology, or create new technology. AGD
attempted the new technology route with their E-mag, and needless to say it
failed to grasp the market share they were hoping for. It will be interesting
to see what AGD comes up with for the next decade.
If I were running AGD I would probably be inclined to pull out of the tourney
gun market and seek to compete with the kingmans of the world. Piece for piece
I still hold that a power feed auto or minimag is still the best newbiegun out
there. If they could come up with a way to lower the price, even 50 dollars, I
could see AGD giving kingman some serious trouble. AGD needs a name for
itself, aside from the one it has now which is essentially "that company that
used to make quality tourney level markers". Even if that reputation becomes
"They make kickass recball guns", at least they'll be able to survive moving
forward.

Mitch
The Big Habeeb

I think that in order to do that, they would need to have them set up to run
well on CO2 out of the box. I don't think many of the Kingman buyers jump
straight to HPA, which I am under the impression a mag needs.

"Big Habeeb" <bighabeeb@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20041221134306.12009.00002137@mb-m16.aol.com...
> >Maybe some new leadership could turn things around. I'd like to see AGD
>>become a prominent force in paintball again.
>
> Wouldn't we all. Unfortunately when you look at the technology
> surrounding
> AGD, it is going to be EXTREMELY difficult for them to be able to cut off
> a
> piece of the market that currently exists.
> Basically, any time a company wants to get a corner of the market they can
> go
> one of two ways: Improve on current technology, or create new technology.
> AGD
> attempted the new technology route with their E-mag, and needless to say
> it
> failed to grasp the market share they were hoping for. It will be
> interesting
> to see what AGD comes up with for the next decade.
> If I were running AGD I would probably be inclined to pull out of the
> tourney
> gun market and seek to compete with the kingmans of the world. Piece for
> piece
> I still hold that a power feed auto or minimag is still the best newbiegun
> out
> there. If they could come up with a way to lower the price, even 50
> dollars, I
> could see AGD giving kingman some serious trouble. AGD needs a name for
> itself, aside from the one it has now which is essentially "that company
> that
> used to make quality tourney level markers". Even if that reputation
> becomes
> "They make kickass recball guns", at least they'll be able to survive
> moving
> forward.
>
> Mitch
> The Big Habeeb

I think AGD would make a great rec-level niche for itself if it simply made a
valve that works as good on CO2 as their current ones do on HPA, and lower the
price.
I also think they could make a good high-level niche for themselves fairly
easily. Take the E-Mag, get rid of the huge battery foregrip, replace the
return spring with a solenoid, and drill in some eyes (better hype than the
Lvl10). I truly think with a few relatively minor changes and some advertising,
they could become the Tippman of the e-guns.

> energy and "zip" that will be required to move his company into the next
> decade.
>
> Mitch
> The Big Habeeb


Or, more likely, he figured he's made enough money with his military
contracts that he decided he'd stop working so hard and start enjoying
himself.

> If I were running AGD I would probably be inclined to pull out of the
> tourney
> gun market and seek to compete with the kingmans of the world. Piece for
> piece


Have you seen the tach one? They're not cheap, but they are directed at us
rec ball players.

I think that AGD could easily rule the rec-ball scene with a change in
marketing schemes. Look, we all know that AGD has not held a prominent spot in
tourney paintball in a good number of years, for whatever the reasons might
be...chalk it up to technology, trend, whatever you like. The truth is, with a
wide range of n2 tanks available in the 50 dollar range, the cost of n2 really
isn't all that prohibitive any longer, though you're right, it is an expense
that AGD has, that some others (kingman and tippman in particular) do not.
Hell, look at video games. This Hastings Tourney Paintball game for instance.
Many MANY markers are represented, some tourney level, some not-so-much. But
the one major manufacturer who doesn't get so much as a single mention in the
game is AGD. Again, maybe it was simply that the game designers and the
company couldn't come to an agreement (for example, the shocker / impulse are
also not represented, as aren't the bushmaster and the like)...but it just
shows again that AGD isn't taken as a serious player in the tourney market.

As for the redesign of the e-mag, I think you'll find it very difficult to
create the setup you are referring to without violating one patent or another
in the electromarket. Hell, look at the number of lawsuits already in progress
/ in the past.

No, I think if AGD hopes to move with the future of paintball, they'll re-think
their priorities and figure out a way to DOMINATE the rec-gun market. Lets be
honest here, is there a SINGLE other marker that you would purchase for rec
purposes, if you took cost out of the picture? Yes tippman is great and
all...but I'm the first to admit, I still have a minimag kicking around the
bottom of my paintball bag. Why? Because I know the damn thing will ALWAYS
work, and for rec-ball days it lets me not feel like I'm outgunning the newbies
too horribly. AGD is still struggling to say "we make a tourney gun" in a
market that is FLOODED with options, most if not all substantially better than
anything AGD has out there. Think about it...back in the day you essentially
had 2 tourney guns...cockers and mags. Now look around at how many guns you
see at an event...and from how many different manufacturers. Some companies
have continued to thrive (WGP for instance) while others have faded out of
existance (sheridan). If AGD doesn't rethink their company goals, I fear they
may join the latter group in terms of their paintball division.

Mitch
The Big Habeeb

>I think AGD would make a great rec-level niche for itself if it simply made a
>valve that works as good on CO2 as their current ones do on HPA, and lower
>the
>price.
>I also think they could make a good high-level niche for themselves fairly
>easily. Take the E-Mag, get rid of the huge battery foregrip, replace the
>return spring with a solenoid, and drill in some eyes (better hype than the
>Lvl10). I truly think with a few relatively minor changes and some
>advertising,
>they could become the Tippman of the e-guns.

In article <20041221191227.07938.00002413@mb-m07.aol.com>,
mathu41@aol.com (MathU41) wrote:

> I think AGD would make a great rec-level niche for itself if it simply made a
> valve that works as good on CO2 as their current ones do on HPA, and lower
> the
> price.

I'm pretty sure they already have the plans and tooling for that -- the
Level 7 valve.

--
Phelps <http://www.donotremove.net>
"Bury me with all my stuff, because you know that it is mine."
-- Master Shake's Suicide Note, "Aqua Teen Hunger Force"